Growing from around 100 thousand to over 1 million followers in 2019 thanks to her simple, to-the-point and effective tools for ‘self healers’ around the world, The Holistic Psychologist (Dr Nicole) joins me for a deep exploration of:
- Why she thinks she has experienced viral growth on Instagram in 2019
- How her fellow psychologists have responded to her holistic approach
- What happens when we drop out of a self-care practice
- How Nicole came up with the hashtag #selfhealers and why self-healing is so important to her
- Why she thinks that consciousness is a foundational practice
- How self-study, inspired by Dr Nicole’s scary physical symptoms, blew her mind about the meat-suit she was in
- Dr Nicole’s opinion about plant-medicine and psychedelic-assisted therapy
- How tiny promises to yourself lead to huge changes over time
The Holistic Psychologist 0:00
showed up differently practised showing up differently for long enough that I've broken down those chains that I had lived around around with them around me for so long and I can actually believe that now that we are capable of healing.
Nate Maingard 0:18
That's the truth and so are you and it's so okay to remember that it's okay to really feel it. Feel every little bit.
Nate Maingard 0:31
Hello, and welcome back. Welcome to the first time dear listeners. My name is Nate Maingard. And thank you for Getting Naked with Nate. This is a podcast where we do our best to strip off all the layers that hide us from one another hide us from ourselves, not literally, but in terms of our emotions and how we express and how we share and how we connect for authenticity, for vulnerability for honesty, make it this really just as feel or opinions expressed openly. So thanks for being here. I am incredibly excited about this week's guest. I should probably say I'm incredibly excited about every week's guests. So this is no different from all the others and it still feels as special as everyone does, because in this moment, I have had an epic conversation with the holistic psychologist, Dr. Nicole, and she is if you haven't heard of her then Wow, I am so excited to be introducing this person to you. And if you have then you know why. She is an instant famous psychologist, Doctor of psychology who has blown up this year on Instagram. She has gone from less than 100,000 followers, I think or maybe around 100,000 when I first found her early this year, to well over a million she's got 1.2 million followers at the time of me recording this podcast episode with her. And there is for good reason she is speaking as she says in this episode to the collective unconscious of humanity right now, where we are seeking something different. We have realised collectively that the way we're living the way we're interacting, the way we're treating ourselves and others, the traumas we carry with us the family heritage passed down through our lineages in our DNA and in our behavioural patterns. These things have not been working for us. And Nicole is one of the people really at the forefront of this shift in human consciousness. I am so grateful and delighted and honoured that she said yes to coming on this podcast. We tried once before it didn't work. And this is our second attempt. And it was just amazing. We cover so many different things. Nicole is just a kind and friendly person. I felt like you know, I was a little nervous when I started, I was like, I'm going to be chatting with this quite well known person at this point. I hope that I'm not wasting her time, all of my own insecurities around those kind of things, but it was within a few seconds that I just felt like Yeah, I'm chatting with one of my people. This is all good. There's nothing to worry about here. And so yeah, we cover a bunch of stuff in this. She's so many I asked her about plant medicine and psychedelic assisted therapy, which is something close to my heart, which you'll know, if you've been listening to my podcast recently, I do share links to a lot of the things we talked about in the show notes as always naked with nate.com, forward slash, the holistic psychologist, all one word, and you can always just go to naked with nate.com and that'll get you to all the places you need to go. Anyway. I'm not going to say much more. Just one more thing is this is a community supported podcast. I would love to have some sponsors I currently don't. The sponsors that I have the supporters I have the patrons I have all my patrons on Patreon, the group of the natives. So if you want to get extended uncut versions of these episodes, I actually have a full extended version of this with the holistic psychologist and I have a video version that is only available to patrons so head on over to naked with nate.com and Click the become a patron button and you'll get access to that. That is all for now I know that you're going to enjoy this and get so much out of it. I got so much out of it. Thank you for being here. Thank you for getting naked with Nate and here is a holistic psychologist. Thank you so much for coming on. And especially as our first attempt when I was on the farm just crashed us so thanks again for being here with me.
The Holistic Psychologist 4:24
Of course of course it's my pleasure I'm happy worked out in blocking off recording days now trying to sanction the rest of my time with all the other things so my honour I'm really
Nate Maingard 4:33
happy that it worked out. Yay. I have to say I'm a little sad at the moment because I saw your is it called self healing circle that you've got. Yes, man. I was watching that so closely. And the day that it went live I hit that hit the button to go on. But I was out with family at the time and I was like oh, that's it's happening I'll do when I get home got home and I was like this has been closed for this right
The Holistic Psychologist 4:56
went so quick. Nate. It was two hours. It sold out. So I had no expectation for I knew many were interested. I'm going to launch it again. So do not worry and a couple months was a little bit more settled and I'm moving this winter too. So I have a lot going on. But on the other side of that, I'll definitely be reopening up because I'm getting a lot of similar messages that I missed it I was shocked at how quickly how quickly it ended up.
Nate Maingard 5:24
But sweet, I was not shocked which is why I tried to get on it immediately. I was kind of like I felt like this is gonna go super it's like one of those you know, the concert everyone's been waiting to buy tickets for when it goes live like Burning Man or something like
The Holistic Psychologist 5:38
that whole week. I've slept like a baby truth be told since then. But that whole week I was up excited like Christmas that morning was like cool. I can't just be nine already. Because obviously this has been percolating in my mind and a passion project for me since honestly since I began my own healing journey. So having it live so long up here and then finally the day I got to expel it into the world. I felt like a kid on Christmas and it's been a whirlwind. But since then I've been sleeping like a baby at night. Very cool experience.
Nate Maingard 6:12
That's awesome. I'm so glad, like everything about your growth makes me hopeful and happy for the state of the world right now or like for at least the direction that many of us are headed in because it's just been so it's so needed and so necessary. And actually, that's the one I was kind of throwing out some some requests to people, like if you have any questions for this lovely human I'm going to be chatting with and actually the one person who asked is Mary Lou, a friend of my beloved's who had a similar question to me, which I think I know the answer for but I'm still curious to hear what your thoughts are is, Mary Lou says, I am curious about what she thinks the reason is that she's become so viral, which was basically what I was gonna ask why do you think everything's gone nuts this year for Yeah,
The Holistic Psychologist 6:57
yeah, absolutely. And so I think Always acknowledge that I think similar to the feeling you're having, you know, you say I feel hopeful when I see this, I do believe it's a testament to the the collective and where the collective is in terms of feeling frustrated with the state of treatment options or kind of intuitively knowing that there was more to us as humans. I think that the rapid I had no expectation honestly me. When I first went online, I did not know what would come of the page, I just knew that I wanted an outlet or I need it, I should actually say an outlet to speak my truth in a way that I wasn't fully able to, in my personal into my professional life at the time. So that was the pact me with myself going here. No expectation, just speak your truth. And I think that the rapid viral growth of it is really a testament to where the collective is and I'm speaking to that large so I always joke I say I don't take full credit. Yeah, I show up every day with the medium and I put it on there and I talked the content, I share my storey But I think it really is a testament to the collective where they are, where they want to go. And I even think within the content that I'm offering daily, I'm actually speaking to the collective, I've lived a very similar experience in many ways that I think is very relatable and resonating. And that's again, why it's, you know, it's, it's interesting, I'm starting a book and they're talking about on you and his collective unconscious. And speaking to that similar part that we all share as humans, whether you're where I live, or on the other side of the world, you know, it's kind of the universal aspect of humanity. And that made me think, Oh, that's so interesting. Like that is actually I think, what I'm speaking to when I'm putting the content out there, the tie that binds us all, no matter where you are in your own journey, or on the planet, even
Nate Maingard 8:50
Yeah, it feels like we're in that space. That the realisation coming back to oneness like that the sense of it's we've been pretending for a long time as a collective As a society as a culture, that it's all about the individual experience and just do that thing by yourself for yourself. And it's all about individuation about the individual having the individual experience. And, and and i think that that's still important, but it's also the individual experience only happens through the integration with the whole. And I think that's been missing in our Western approach. I don't know what what do you Yeah,
The Holistic Psychologist 9:23
I agree. And I think if we look in terms of if we want to say, independent on one end of the spectrum and dependent on the other end of the spectrum, I'm never for any end of a spectrum. And I think that the concept that I talk about is inter dependence where we have room for individuality and flexibility in our lives and our choices and our relationships, but really acknowledging that at our core, from an evolutionary standpoint, we are interpersonal creatures, whether it's division of labour concepts we're talking or whether it's the deeper psychological stress relieving attributes of being part of A clan or a group of people, but so interdependence, I think really highlights that because we're not fully I don't believe full empowerment is being completely dependent. I don't believe full full actualization is being completely independent either. So where is that space of interdependence?
Nate Maingard 10:19
Yeah, exactly that actually I wrote a song some years ago called braver and stronger, which wasn't, it wasn't about anyone, but it was definitely when I was kind of having those first feelings of wanting different kind of relating, and especially from a love relationship. And and that time that was many years before I met my beloved and so like I was very, but I knew that I wanted something different and the song is basically a fairy tale and it's about living in a cottage in the woods and the cottage represents the relationship. That's the metaphor in a sense, and it's beautiful because you built it together. We build it together. there's a there's a fireplace, it's warm, it's cosy, everything's lovely in there. The danger of that is that then if That becomes the place we hide in as a way to avoid going out into the woods where the wolves wander and where we've got to deal with the wildness of life, then that becomes the codependent experience. And so anyway, it just made me think of that now what you're saying interdependence and codependence and how we can find our way from from the code to the end. Or the end.
The Holistic Psychologist 11:18
Yeah, I love that. Thank you for sharing that with me. That's a really good visual and I do agree because I think that we can just as easily build that wall you know around whether it's our diag or couple our family unit. In terms of boundaries, it's something that comes up a lot in my work. There's a difference between a wall and a boundary. I heard someone recently I think on social media describe a boundary as a door, you know, you know how the door works, but you can open and shut the door. But I get that question a lot is because I have a tendency I've observed in humans but we do sit at one end of the spectrum again, maybe because of conditioning because of factors that were once out of our control our risk To like a rubber band snap to that other end of the spectrum and like I said that the beauty in life is really in that middle balance. But that's a natural tendency often so on whatever it is that I'm talking about, if I'm so codependent in some way to heal, I'm going to be so drastically independent in all the ways and again, it's how do i equalises and find that balance point in the middle?
Nate Maingard 12:24
Wow, I that's, that that resonates with me deeply. I. So I, one of the things I actually wanted to bring up with you, and if at any point I say anything, and you like I'm not wanting to go in that direction, like we can just move on. But um, something that I haven't seen you talk about it all and I'm very curious to hear your opinions on if you're willing to give is around the huge surge in plant medicine and psychedelic assisted therapy in recent times. So I just love to get your thoughts on that if you'd like to share anything.
The Holistic Psychologist 12:52
Yeah, absolutely. In terms of topics. I'm really an open book, so I'm pretty much going to probably follow you wherever You offer so yeah, in terms of plant medicine, I actually, I have a global response, whether we're talking plant medicine, whether we're talking a life altering, workshop, workshop, culture is very big workshop retreat experience, whether we're talking a really pivotal meditation that I've now found, and I really can access some state of consciousness, whatever it is, I might, my response is always the same. incredibly impactful tools for many of us. So in terms of plant medicine, having an altered consciousness experience becoming maybe more connected with ourselves or the collective going to a terrain of our subconscious mind that we can't access otherwise pivotal, impactful 100% so I think the workshop I go to a workshop I learn something new, I tap into a new aspect of self amazing. I'm more concerned about what happens on the other side, because we have to at some point carry that growth or that evolution or that Consciousness, whatever it is that we've gained in that moment, most of us that we use unless we run off to now be living on the Iosco retreat and maybe working you know, in that reality Maybe, maybe not, or going back home to life as we know it to the systems as they are not that we can't come home a different human, but at some point, we do need to begin to then actualize probably new choices to maintain. So I call anything, whether it's plant medicine, or workshops, or retreats, or even meditative experiences, tools, with our goal being to live those tools throughout our day where our autopilot is lurking, or our mind actually prefers to live in that very patterned way that it's used to. So even if I had a life altering plant medicine experience, my patterns leading up to that are very much condition their patterns, and they likely will try to continue right I'm going to wake up that next following day and the thing I do in the morning, two days before the Truth probably gonna be the same thing I'm wanting or compelled to do then so it's how do we maintain I think those changes. So tools Yeah, I've heard of a lot of even clients who would come to me to work with when I was doing the individual work post one of those experiences having access something new or some state of consciousness that propelled them then into the healing journey. And then obviously, we did the work around actually using those tools in a consistent way.
Nate Maingard 15:29
I'm so glad you said that I that is such a key piece that I have seen and an experienced is missing in so much of the medicine work, whether that's plant medicine based or breath work based, or whatever else based as you say, and and I'm a pure living example of that I really have had that experience of bouncing back and forth and having these sort of mystical expanded experiences and then waking up actually might one of my most recent songs that I wrote this year called every leaf came exactly out of that I woke up the next morning, having it was my first actual psychedelic assisted therapy, so it was really as a conscious step into this powerful medicine. And it really like expanded wealth expanded beyond the bounds of anything ever. And, and it was, it was so it was a relief to realise that there is so much more than the boundaries of Nathan like the circle that I have around myself is just a part of something whole and can dissolve into that and it's not an end it's a continuation and all of those beautiful amazing things that happen woke up the next day and I was like I'm still depressed and I still have chronic pain and I still don't know what I'm doing with my life and it was it was so intense and through that I wrote a song which was basically a representation just a reminder almost like a song of of the mystical interplay of everything with everything else and it's and I'm so grateful that happened and it still doesn't resolve the actual day to day stuff and and so this is the one of the things I wanted to check in about as an interesting. So I so this year has been all about healing for me self healing. It's been therapy. It's been psychedelic asst Be breath work all the things and for cheese or like five or six months I was my morning practice was solid i was i was on its first thing you know for 32 between 430 and 530 and morning up doing the journaling doing the breath work doing them thing that thing all the things and then it just it's somehow got harder and harder and harder. And eventually I stopped and had the the old pattern of as soon as I miss a few days I'm like I'm never doing this again and then it's almost impossible in mentally and therefore physically to take the step to start it again. And so in a way I guess the question I had for you and I'm because I'm sure so many people have had this experience of and in my case it was like I was like I'm finally broke through that resistance I come there and having the experience. So I'm I feel like now I'm back at square one. What now?
The Holistic Psychologist 17:48
Well, I want to offer two things to that person that there are a lot of us, myself included. The first thing is the why. So our subconscious I mean what we're doing, we're creating a new habit. We are shifting out of that autopilot our subconscious is incredibly patterned from our daily behaviours to the daily thoughts that we think we tend to think things on repeat in a very pattern way then to the way that those thoughts make us feel. So when we change when we set an intention to change, even if logically so logic is coming from our conscious mind, not our subconscious, so logically, you as you know, you can sit here and be like, okay, all of these great morning routines are going to help me for all these reasons awesome. When are some when our subconscious is always online, it's always I just like the computer analogy, it's the most understand it's always online. It is quite literally been a participant in log every experience that we've ever had in life thus far. And we'll do that until we're no longer on this planet. So it's always receiving information that throughout our day, it's very black and white, as I call it. This is a really simple explanation sorry, black and white. So it registers things into dichotomous ways the one and and it's mainly derive is for protection. It feels like it's keeping us safe against threat these programmes right? So the one end of the spectrum is familiar equals safe predictable I know what happens as a result of this thing and I'm okay with that. Even if it's not comfortable if it's familiar to me so it can't hurt me kill me etc. Of course none of this is logical because chances are any not not many habits put it that way could kill us but right so but this is the principle that it operates on other end of that spectrum is unfamiliar, possible threat, bad to be avoided. So I will universally speak this truth because I believe it changes hard universally for all of us for that reason, even if logically, I know that this morning routine is going to help me be at day one, day five day 15. When I wake up to do it, I the mental resistance that you very much acknowledge is there I defined happens into two sectors, the mind litany of court case reasons why not to do this thing or never to do it again or some of us again in our bodies, we start to just feel a little bit agitated, a little bit uncomfortable, I call it different than we usually feel. Because we're very much used to how feeling sit in our body, that becomes our baseline. So resistance system is part of it, why it might happen at month, one month to month three, is because as you live these new choices, Nate chances are you starting to feel differently and more different and more different. Again, setting up the alerts from that subconscious that Whoa, this is unknown terrain, possibly dangerous, please come back into the rut of familiarity that I'm used to. And then of course, we have a little bit of our thinking and our narratives. Like you said, one of my patterns is when I fall off, I know I'm never going to do this again. Because all your subconscious has as evidence is what's happened in the past and chances aren't that has been what's happened in the past. So now we're right having to separate ourselves from that narrative that know this time. It doesn't have to be like that the past does not have to predict my future. So the practical that That's conceptually why and you know what's also happening for the unique human that you are right having, we all of us have that pattern. I know I look back and I did not maintain my habits. So similar to you is like, there's that time and space where I don't do this again, or it takes me a long time to get back to it. Or maybe I'm not meant to do it on a practical level, because I know that change is hard. You'll hear me talk about a concept called Small daily progress, which is really just highlighting the role that expectations play. So if we set the expectation so if you say, look at what you're the last day you ever did your routine, maybe you're doing four beautiful things in the morning. I do not suggest you when you do reengage the habit and do not expect you put an expectation that you're going to go right back to that wake up our event. Those four things. I suggest you take what I call a foundational approach. One thing one small step, and depending on what time week has now been, sometimes our smallest step is just waking up 15 Few minutes earlier before I even do anything in that new 15 minutes, right, so we just have to ease our way back and rebuild our foundation back as far as I see it.
Nate Maingard 22:10
Perfect. Thank you so much. And so I, one of the things that comes up for me a lot watching, like you, I mean, I really consider you to be one of the necessary voices, especially on a platform like Instagram, which is inherently dangerous for the well being of people who use it or who are generally addicted to it, and myself included and that's how it's built to be. Even with that I find myself at times I've saved or bookmarked and I know I've spoken with several friends who are the same, so many of your posts and go I'm going to go back to that and like do something about it. It's this thing of, of, I guess information overload and then the resultant overwhelm that comes because of it. So if you had to say if it was the last thing you could ever say that was going to help people would you say what you've just said is one is like the primary thing is start making tiny promises to yourself. Keep those tiny promises and then slowly slowly build on that and go from there or what would you add to that? What would you say in that situation?
The Holistic Psychologist 23:12
Yeah, I think that's a really foundational principle. I think a foundational practice Nate is consciousness is teaching ourselves how to be an active participant in our day to day life, which Same thing goes small promise of consciousness. So I do know while I am infinitely grateful for the platform, that is Instagram, allowing me those squares to get my message out for as long as I have and to gain the community. I do know that it can produce overwhelm because on Sundays I'm talking about two separate concepts. So that is one of the reasons why I evolve and I'm offering this membership model where will slow it down. I will be presenting people with a path through what can definitely create overwhelmed but even in that model, we're taking a small daily promise approach and we're talking First and foremost about the concept of consciousness because without I simplify things a lot. So here's one of those instances with, I find two steps to change. Right? If we want to see a future that's different, we're interested in change. So the two steps, first step is pivotal. Without step one, there's not step two, step one is learning how to be conscious learning how to be a participant, in whether it's my daily behaviours and my lifestyle habits. Whether it's the fact that I can participate in my mental world, I am participating in my mental world without even knowing it for some of us, that then allows step two, which is making new choices, even though they're uncomfortable walking through that right unfamiliarity with the possible threat of something new, that's going to be part of it. But unless I'm conscious, I don't get that option to be a participant because my autopilot is running the show. And it's going to run the show exactly the way it's run the show for however many years it's you've been on this planet so far. So that's Another foundational piece that any listener out there. So if there's a, okay, well, what's one small daily promise that I could build in? It could be anything I have been sharing. One of my followers has talked about an incredible journey she's been on now for several months. That's another thing this takes time. Right? These are not the immediate feedback tools that we are also living in a culture that we have, right? I can take the pill and I feel better in 20 minutes or I can be online, I'm distracted from whatever is uncomfortable we can we have a culture of right now. So something else I like to just acknowledge is these aren't right now. We don't feel better. But I've been sharing a member who her first small daily promise was glass of water. So every morning she wants to start our day with a glass of water. And you know whether or not water was an arbitrary thing or not, it was just the act of keeping a promise to the self. She's evolved into losing a significant amount of weight really changing her life several months later, but it began with just consistently showing up every morning and Keeping that promise to make a glass of water so whatever the promise is, can be anything. But if someone listening is looking for a where to start learning how to access consciousness, whether it's in a one minute meditation or something I've been using is a conscious check in where we use our senses to just be as present as possible to the current moment sounds Little Big, big effects because like I said, without practising that your moments going to be on repeat, you're going to live the moment the way you lived all of your moments. And for some of us that's not even for me at least it was not even present. It was tucked away on my dissociative spaceship as I call it, not here not not participant in life.
Nate Maingard 26:40
Beautiful I yeah, I'm definitely going to share links to all your pages, etc, in the show notes so that anyone who is interested in getting more because you share such great stuff on Instagram or so on YouTube and then on your blog, so I'll make sure people have access to all of that for if they want to dive deeper, which I do recommend. Now I'm curious about how because you're a doctor of psychology, right like that's huge. trained in the world's in the universities and the things and they gave you the certificate and the said you are now a professional
The Holistic Psychologist 27:07
get that, I did not think at one point I was going to actually successfully do that. But I did Yeah, a PHD in analytical psychology. So pretty much the most traditional way to practice that was my goal was to open a practice I say the most traditional way because now licensure has evolved that you can receive masters in different aspects of counselling and also practice but for a long time, this was the only shoot that allows you to call yourself a psychologist and have a private practice as we know it where you come in and you talk and you are supported through
Nate Maingard 27:37
got you, got you and so what is why are you different like if do what is it about you as a person as an the character, the development, whatever it was that brought you to because you clearly asked some different questions and I have gone a very different route to to the majority of other psychologists in the world right now and I I know that the movement is shifting in this direction, but I'm just curious to know why you?
The Holistic Psychologist 28:04
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, why I'm different, I wasn't different. Let me start by acknowledging that I, on a personal and on a professional level, meaning Personally, I've always known anxiety I was a very anxious kid, I was fearful of the world, of course, with this much longer conversation, but very much intergenerational passed on in my family, etc. So I was very anxious, I thought I would always be somewhat anxious I was of the belief as a lot of us are taught and told society even that some people have that chip or don't have that chip. And this is the Carter doubt. So I was identified as an anxious person. I intuitively loved the mind. So always wanted to be that psychologist. That was my my place of interest. So as soon as you asked me what I was going to be, I was going to be that psychologist. When my anxiety peaked. I was in therapy for multiple years, multiple hours a week even at times, and I was on medication. So like I said, I'm very much more marched along. When I opened up my practice it was very much a supportive top base place. So I did focus it on mindfulness because at that point of my personal journey, I did not at my time, I was in school learn of mindfulness event. We were very much taught CVT, kind of a manual eyes approach to treatment. So that was the tools I was given in school very limited as far as I now look back and see, I picked up mindfulness I opened up a practice but same thing people came in they talked a lot of them had psychiatrist or medication that they also were taking to for their wellness flashing forward in time, it was my own physical, emotional and spiritual I now know health crisis that sent me into a whirlwind of fear about what was wrong with me. At this point, my physical symptoms were scary. I was fainting, I was forgetting sentences, people's names, mid sentence, things that I never experienced before. So I really thought Nate it was something physically wrong likely with my brain. So I dove online first and foremost, to try to get a diagnosis for myself so I could find my way out of whatever the heck was happening. And in that self study, my mind was blown. I was being I was being introduced in different fields and sectors. So this whole other world of even science of epigenetics, where we're evolving to the reality that things aren't genetically determined, yeah, we are born with a set of genes and codes, but our environment, those choices that we're making each day is the difference between whether we get that thing or we don't not as I once thought out, that was just my hand. I was introduced to the body, the meat suit that we're in and the role that that plays in the role. physiological and hormonal imbalances play with symptoms. Anxiety is a big one. Depression is a big one. We now are of the belief that the food we're eating is causing damage in our guts, in particular, that is causing those symptoms upstream that they're very real. Never Was I thought of that, I learned about this whole new world of trauma, where trauma not even just big t not the big cataclysmic thing that most of us identify with trauma, low level unmet needs in childhood, not feel feeling fully seen heard and expressed, can cause a low level of trauma response in the body. So, a lot of us humans are living with a dis regulated nervous system that are again, preventing healing. So I started to see all of this I started to see, I've always been someone who's been somewhat interested in the spiritual realm. But for me, it was conceptual. So I've picked up the books and the philosophers. I took a lot of philosophy and an undergrad, but they were concepts to me, they were definitely not talked about in my programmes either. So again, I go right back into that literature. And I started to understand those more spiritual than concepts in a practical way. So this was a hasn't had some deep, honest conversations with myself. At this point, and that's why I shifted and why I appear different because I am acknowledging that's what holistic means, to me means two things. It means mind, body, soul, we all have all three of those parts, we are not just the mind, traditional therapy just treats mind. So I think that's very much limiting. I also believe holistic means identifying, and this is seen in functional medicine, that evolution that's happening in the medical field, which I'm thrilled about treating with underlying the symptoms that a lot of us are calling our destiny. They're not anymore. And again, I think that's another limitation in terms of the traditional field. So my community is surprisingly I was scared. I was scared, not only of what would people just as humans think of my message, what would my colleagues think of my message? I thought, Oh, man, here I am putting myself out there. What if other psychologists or mental health professionals see this message, they're going to think I'm nuts, they're gonna think I'm threatening and I don't know what they're gonna think over Well normally supportive I mean, I've actually been having professional mentorship sessions with a lot of them, helping them to update their practice. So back to where we started. The numbers even in the field of practitioners are a testament to people are practitioners themselves or even feeling limited they're starting to realise that those old tools are the whole storey.
Nate Maingard 33:21
Thank you so much for that story that that that got me in the feels there just hearing it just when the whole I mean your whole story is phenomenal and I love it. And it's it's kind of it sounds a lot like the story of my life in many ways of like, just feeling like things weren't. I couldn't just gel with the story I'd been told and it just never managed but then hearing you say that your community of therapists have like rallied and are in fact you can do mentoring sessions and can be That to me is like just that I give deep thanks for that. It's so important.
The Holistic Psychologist 33:57
I'm thrilled at not only the direction The collective is going but I'm so and I always believe somebody. So there will still be that traditional model. Some people will want this space and need that space to go and talk, I'm by no means trying to, you know, kind of offer the statement that that's not necessary, it's going to be part of it. But I also want and I am totally whatever resources I put out, I'm very transparent and open and I tell other professionals use them. Use them if it's going to help your practice because my goal really, is to just empower the individuals that are willing and open to this message. Because another reality I know is that not everyone, this message isn't for everyone. Maybe not right now. Maybe not ever, but the people that it's for so back when I acknowledge I'm just going on there to speak my truth. I've settled in that the people that are interested in my truth will gravitate toward me, I never would have imagined in this mass. But there are people that are wanting these new for this new version of mental wellness. That's another shift. I think the conversation from symptom management riding the wave of the diagnosis to wait, let's actually shift that and start to talk about the wellness that some most of us can achieve.
Nate Maingard 35:13
I was wondering around the terms because I see you use the term self healers a lot like that's basically, your your, your hashtag on Instagram is self healers. What did is that your term that you came up with? Or how how did you connect with that as a term or I love it so much. I was just wondering if there's a little storey with
The Holistic Psychologist 35:31
Thank you. Yeah, so, I did come up with it back when I first launched the Instagram. How I came up with it. I think I just really so I share a lot about my own healing journey because it's been a journey and I've seen such significant change. And here's one of those areas. I had so much whether it was because like I said earlier, I had that genetic chip that predisposition predisposition me to anxiety, whether it was what my physical body was capable of doing or not doing or what it looked like or didn't like to my personality, I very much had what I call a limiting belief system meaning I had my box or my lane. And that's the lane that I was destined to be in always. And I was gifted with my partner could not be who see me and been with me before my evolution and obviously so currently with me, could not be more opposite than me in any ways. So she became my point of reference of comparison, if you will, very early on where I would see ways her body looked or formed or her aspects of her personality. And I, she was a prime example for me like, oh, you're there because you have those things that I don't have. So my lane remains here and your lane is over there and I cannot access the things that I'm seeing you do or be or say or what have you. So I share my journey because the healing journey has led me to Breaking down that those walls I now understand those limitations did true. I mean, I know this is one of the very cliched maybe feeling things that's going on the internet right now, although it's all in your mind, but it really is all in our minds in such a powerful way. So self healing and that concept is so meaningful to me. The fact that I have eight that that's what it embodies, for me is the fact that I showed up differently practised showing up differently for long enough that I've broken down those chains that I had lived around around with them around me for so long, and I can actually believe that now that we are capable of healing the self is capable of healing and changing so I was just thinking in terms one day of that concept, and I put those two words together and I really liked it. And so the personal aspect of it is how meaningful so when I share that I'm like, Oh, you know, cuz I know people are picking up to the communities. somewhere down the line of my own journey, so who they see me being now, you know, isn't who I always was in this world, even in the more recent past, even in my evolution of putting myself out there in this new way, watching myself get more and more comfortable with what's still challenging, but what was once debilitating about being on a camera and talking to people, and you know, there was just a lot of it. So that's what it means to me. And it's a very meaningful concept. And I think similarly, it's picking up because it's talking to that maybe that intuitive knowing that you very beautifully described that sense that we were born with that as far as I see it. We are born I will always describe humans with using two adjectives. We are from from the moment we arrived on this planet, how everything we get here I call I describe this as it as intuitive and adaptive. So that sense that a lot of us have always had all along something's not matching or something's not right, or this isn't actually how it is for me or could be different. That's that intuition. Speaking. What has happened though, is We've made adaptations based in those environments that we've been born into, that become condition. So I say our journey is back to that really intuitive space, that inner knowing that has always known that we just need to react us or rebuild trust in it. And I believe that any self can heal to that extent, but that's the journey of healing is a return in a sense.
Nate Maingard 39:23
Hmm. So interesting, you say that that's actually something I thought of earlier when we were talking about plant medicines and, and really those kind of experiences. And I had actually my last, so the way that I'm currently using promises, and I'm using psilocybin, and I'm using it both with micro dosing, which is for those who don't know, sub perceptual doses, so in a small enough month that I don't add a small enough amount that I don't feel any different, but that it's supposedly in it and in my experience has some kind of a shift in my default mode network where I just get a little looseness in my thoughts that I can make changes more easily. At least I I'm finding that and then every three to four months, and this isn't like a lifetime thing. But at the moment I'm working with a therapist and every three to four months, I do what they call a hero's dose, which is five grammes dried. And it's a very powerful, very overwhelming, but and also very healing, when done safely with a guide in a safe environment, all of those things in place. It's a hugely therapeutic experience. And my most recent one, which was now a month or so ago, for the first time, the only person who sat with me and I definitely wouldn't recommend this for anyone who's inexperienced or doesn't know where they are in their in their head space or anything like that. But this most recent one, for some reason, my facilitator couldn't make it last minute. And my beloved offered to step in, and she's had a lot of experience with these medicines. And so it felt in alignment. And it was just such a profound experience. And one of the kind of gifts I was given through that. It was like, this is the first time in my life I've had healing from my community without having to pay for it in a sense, and I was like, this is how it should be. This is how it was, is that whatever we needed, our community was there and would hold us in that. And I saw myself as this isolated little person. And so that's what I've built as a way to stay safe, safe, where it's like, oh, well, if I just can be totally independent and build myself up and do everything by myself and heal by myself, then I'll be safe and well, and it'll all be okay. And I can just show the world how healed I am. And it's all good. And what the medicine showed me in that moment was like, here's your community of one, you are part of a greater community and your journey now is to reintegrate into that realisation and as you say, find that middle piece self healed so that we all heal because through the self old exists anyway, so that's what it made me think of.
The Holistic Psychologist 41:42
I am smiling so big Nate because that that's been a really an impetus to the group healing membership model that I've evolved is and from a personal stance or perspective on For me, being so disassociated for so long, one of the biggest areas of impact for me was in my relationships. I had them I was very savvy. I've always been very savvy socially and or personally, I can have a conversation with anyone. However, when it came down to the depth of connection, it stay very surface and it left me feeling highly unfulfilled, I played a part in the same surface, I wasn't president to access my feelings, so then be able to share them or bring them into my relationships. So knowing how much community can heal, knowing how important I mean how interpersonal we are as creatures and how important you know having those experiences are and also symbolically on my own journey from complete separateness to now community healing has been all part of what was so motivating for me to shift out of just the one on one space, which I know is helpful in different ways but to a more collective space because I the collective is happening on the Instagram I I am gifted with one of the most amazing communities on Earth. Social media as far as I see it, at least shout out some some feelers out there incredible supportive. But I was really wondering and hoping to find a way to make it more to make it more intimate to make it more safe feeling to make it more structured, but to harness the power of others so thank you for sharing that experience. I I feel it mimics a lot of my own inner personal healing journey is I'm somewhere where you are now which is okay, here I am, and I can still be separate. But I can find myself within a group to as opposed to just being myself so separate out of protection.
Nate Maingard 43:36
Right. Exactly. Exactly that it's Yeah, and I see it happening a lot. I don't know if I mean as as someone who I who is a man who identifies as a man however anyone wants to call that I I've been following some lovely the sacred sons and I think it's now man tribe as well both on Instagram and it's all about and fortunate. Unfortunately for me, they're all based in California and They're doing this incredible men's work and it's so revolving around this community, holding one another accountable coming into space together. And I do think like, just from a sort of selfish or maybe not selfish but from a personal point I would love to see self healers have physical groups and you've probably you're probably thinking about all this stuff. But like, to me, that's what I want to head is because I've spent so much of my time even as a professional creator online sitting in front of my computer connecting with people through the internet, and it doesn't have the same full effect of actually sitting in a room with other people.
The Holistic Psychologist 44:32
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. So what I've been doing and I'm if you've seen it in LA, and in New York, I've done pop up free meditation events for that reason to I it's selfish, I want to be there and see the humans behind all the hashtags, you know, and have those connections for myself. It's also I want and I urge now I make it a point of when I'm speaking to the group that comes out, which is things big groups of people have been coming out for this really wanting to connect? So I make that as an intention to like honouring that maybe not everyone does. But I've been watching I mean, there's people that were like we just made friends, we're going to coffee after that. I mean, part of it is to foster those. So that's been the way that I've been approaching it. Part of the founding members. Membership, I'm going to be doing pop up events and things like that, depending on where I am trying to evolve cuz I couldn't agree more. And I had not heard of those movements in LA, which is where I'm moving in a couple months. So yeah, it all to hear that that exists already, especially from it because I talk and think often about just gender messaging that art is given at, as far as I say, societal Lee and you often will hear me say I feel for men and a lot of ways because I don't think that there's as much safe space for a lot of men who are looking for it. And I'm so happy to hear that evolution is happening in the flesh too.
Nate Maingard 45:58
thank you for saying that. That means A lot i one of the things I'm wanting to talk more about just is that I'm often I'm the storey that I here as a man in the world is that the world was built by meet people like me, for people like me, I'm a straight white man, like the world is my oyster with the whole thing was designed for me. And, and I, I get that and I do not deny that at all. What I what I think isn't being acknowledged enough is that I have spent my whole life feeling out of place and feeling confused about why is the world this way and how how did we build something like this and, and I want it to be different. And so I love I love that we can have those kind of conversations. Have those inclusive conversations again, it's not either or it's not what about me? It's about what about all of us, like how we all we are all impacted, I think men and then the wounded masculine masculine is as negatively impacted by the Patriot by the patriarchal structures as any of the other people are, and it just doesn't show something Because you see the men sort of strutting around with all this social power and having all the having all the control that they have control because they have no inner sense of strength. Anyway, I don't know if that's making sense.
The Holistic Psychologist 47:11
Yeah, no, I think that's beautiful. And I couldn't agree more in many ways. And I just understand all I view societal shifts and dynamics and structures and pull a note. That is, they're human. So I view them through all the lenses of trust, you know, hurt traumatised wounded people, right, their egos trying to grass use the word beautiful use control, for safety in different ways. And I think that just replicates itself, whether we're talking the micro in terms of just relationships between whomever genders, not genders, whatever. And then to the macro as well. I think if you understand the mind and the human psyche, you could just see it replicating and all of those kind of expanding out layers
Nate Maingard 47:58
and it's doing that...as a final sort of thing because I know we've got to head off in a moment. But as it's doing, it replicates the other way as well, when everything you've just said, when when I as a conscious person can develop that awareness and you as a conscious person develops that awareness, and then all the people we know, are developing conscious awareness, what we're doing is we're replicating a different way of approaching it a different way of looking at it. And so to finish, I just, I guess I just say thank you for being one of the people who is really like accelerating that replication of consciousness in the world today. And thank you for coming on this podcast. Thanks for getting naked with Nate.
The Holistic Psychologist 48:34
I appreciate you saying that. And I reflect that right back to you and beyond just having me on this, you know, on this podcast for this chat, I'm indebted to every person that was interested in hearing about me and my storey along the way because you just helped me to continue to speak it and to now hit members of your audience that maybe hadn't heard from me or me or maybe have heard of me at a time. So beautiful thing that's happening to I've people that have become I've now you know, 10 years a year and a half plus on Instagram, I have people that maybe had met me at a time in their healing journey where they weren't open to the message that I was sending. And I've gotten a couple messages of openness of readiness. Now, although I'm going to be honest, I haven't followed you or whatever around this post. And I'm back now because I can hear some of these things and use them in a new way. But whether it's this conversation I'm having with you the work you're putting out in the world, I'm honoured to, to do this, you know, and to raise the consciousness of the collective alongside amazing humans like yourself. So thank you.
Nate Maingard 49:34
Thank you so much. What a wonderful experience.
Nate Maingard 49:39
I'm sure you'll agree that that was pretty rad. So please do go check out the show notes. Now. That's where you can find links to all of the holistic psychologists, lovely stuff, the wonderful Nicole, and also a few things we talked about. I've tried to link to them. But overall, I just hope that this bought you what you needed today, and I Would love to hear if it did. If you feel anything that you want to communicate with me, as I've said before, a podcast is somewhat strange to me, I'm used to live streaming or more kind of direct engagement or interaction, I should say. So I don't I'm just speaking into the void now and trusting that it's landing where it needs to land. And so what I'd love from you is that if you could go to naked with nate.com, and leave me a comment on the post, or click the say hello, menu button and say hello to me in a voice note, or any other way that you'd like, and thank you so much to those who have left new reviews recently. I'll read you one or two of those reviews just because they're making me feel so good. So thank you to it was Remo Lou, who said so honest and raw and relatable. Love Nate and his humaneness. I love you in your humaneness because only a person who is in their humaneness would say something like that. So thank you so much, very much Reema loo. hope I'm saying that right? Really appreciate your listening. It's a great honour to have you here was the thank you so much to Elena who left an awesome five star review that I'm not going to read out her five star review because I am going to play you the voice note that she so kindly left you can also leave a voice note go to naked of nate.com. And you'll see there's a little button at the top where you can I think it says Say hi or say hello or something like that. You can click that and leave me a voice note or a message. And so this is from the wonderful Elena from Switzerland.
Okay. Hi, Nate. Hi, here's Elena. I found your podcast a few days ago actually. And I love it. It's so good. It's it's really heartwarming and just I love it. I cannot say it in any other words, but those simple ones. Yeah, you know, I've been going through the craziest time ever. And then I found your podcast. And it's just given me kind of comfort and a sense of safety, like, feel like a little less weird, I think. Which is just sometimes really helpful. Yeah, and the people that you interview, they're all the people that I follow and or listen to. And yeah, it's just, it's just really, really beautiful for me. So thank you so much. Just a big thank you. I send you a lot of love and a big hug from Switzerland. Bye
Nate Maingard 52:32
Elena, what a beautiful message. Thank you so much. You really made my day. I've listened to that a bunch of times. So if anyone else wants to send me voice notes, go to nakedwithnate.com forward slash Hello, HELLO and I will gladly throw it into an episode just because you're fantastic. And it means so much to me and it makes me feel fabulous. And that brings us to the end of this week's episode. This is what I'm doing. I love it. I'm so enjoying This podcast as I said earlier at the beginning of this, if you want to help support it, it is currently unfunded from any source other than the one that flows from your generous heart. If you love it supported pay, get on the caffeinated level on my on my Patreon or you could buy me a coffee a month keeping me fueled for these podcast episodes. I love doing them. I'm going to keep doing them either way. And if you get value out of them, please do try to offer some value in return. If you cannot afford monetary value exchanges, then go and leave me comments say amazing things. I want to hear from you. I love hearing from you. Otherwise, listen and share with all of your people pass it on to those who you think will benefit from it. I have some really cool guests lined up the wonderful Kate McGill who was suggested and connected by Kino Grannis. I also have Lily lebow, who is an independent adult worker. She is a become a friend of mine over the last few months and we go into all of that in the podcast. Episode I just totally another favourite. So many great episodes. If you have any guests you think I should have on? Why don't you suggest them to me? Go to naked of nate.com do all the lovely things, enjoy your amazing Take care of yourself Take care of each other. You're a fantastic, wonderful example of life expressing itself. Thanks for getting naked tonight. I'll see you next week.
Nate Maingard 54:23
Well I'm here naked, that's the truth and so are you and it's okay to remember that it's okay to really feel every little bit
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
Links & Things
- The Holistic Psychologist pages
- Watch the extended VIDEO version of this episode on Patreon
- Self Healers Circle
- Jung’s collective unconscious
- My podcast episode about Interdependence vs Codependence (featuring the song Braver & Stronger)
- Every Leaf, a song of the mystical interplay of everything with everything else (podcast episode featuring Every Leaf)
- CBT is Cognitive Behavioural Therapy
- My podcast episode about using psychedelic-assisted therapy
- Sacred Sons and Man Tribe
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